why 330 mm?

[propolis]

Some reference books now in print give 330mm as the standard nut-to-bridge string length of a full size violin. I've spoken with a luthier who prefers 325 to 326mm, saying that a professional player will typically complain that 330mm strings feel too long.

My inner conspiracy theorist wonders if it is a commercial plan to render old instruments obsolete, if enough kids learn on "long" fiddles...

Is there a well-accepted "right answer" here?

[Michael Darnton]

I dunno. Every high quality violin I've ever seen has been in the neighborhood of 130 neck with 195 stop, and who measures the string length, anyway? Some del Gesus go as small as 193 stop, and some Strads as large as 197, but I still have no idea what string length that gives.

Oh, wait, let me measure: 130 neck, 195 stop, that equals 326. Where's the conspiracy here, except on the part of bad violin factorys of 100 years ago to sell oversize violins? :-) :-) :-)

Since no good shop I've ever been familiar with measures string length, lets call it an effort of People Who Write Books But Don't Know Anything About Violins to start something.

[propolis]

If I recall right, I've heard my luthier friend say that 197 was too long of a stop when an oldish German trade fiddle was on his counter. But, memory does not always serve. Oh joy, an excuse for further inquiry...

What made me even ask in the first place, after hearing his strongly expressed views on "useful measurements," was seeing that 330mm number again in the setup sections of that English book that comes so well recommended.

I guess I won't worry about string length, just stand them up between the nicks and fit the feet as best I can, using the numbers the boss provides. I like to think some of these Chinese rentals sound OK for what they are. Nicest violin I've ever been in the same little room with was made early 20th century by an amateur who worked days at Starett. It only took one note to impress me.

g'night,

Prentice

[ozgida]

There was a recent thread on positioning the bridge (either here or on the fingerboard) and it was stated by someone whose judgement I respect that the string length should be 328-329 mm. So I measured mine and found it was a mere 325 mm; also, the bridge was not centered at the notches in the f-holes. Well, the luthier who set up my violin knew what she/he was doing, because moving the bridge back just 2-3 mm to get the "correct" length (and also centered at the notches) made my violin have an unpleasntly dull, dry sound. (I made sure the bridge was straight and the feet had full contact.) Interesting experiment, though. I think the person who made the post on 328-329 mm was just quoting trusted sources. Maybe those numbers are a starting point (which is why the notches on my violin put the strings at 328-329 mm) but then the bridge should be adjusted to get the best sound.

[fiddlecollector]

Interesting,when i sell violins players always ask the string length ,very rarely do they ask for stop length?

I would say that its just players ignorance.

My friend has played for 40 years and has many violins but ask him a question such as what shape the corners are or what the blocks are made of and you`ll get a blank expression, but he knows the exact string length of each one.

I always make my violins with a 130mm neck and 195mm body stop and have been watching with interest at comments suggesting 330mm string length.

I have the Johnson and Courtnall book and if you read the section on set up,he suggests the 330mm as a starting point.

I believe this is too much as i don`t think anyone wants to move the bridge back and end up with a string length of 332-333mm.

Japanese buyers usually want 325mm or even less.

I believe 330mmm gives bad intonation problems.

Just my views on the matter.

[Michael Darnton]

I have an example of how this kind of measurement can spread: on another forum this discussion came up, and someone who wrote a widely respected book quoting 330mm distinctly remembered that when he wrote the book he'd put the measurement in without measuring, and now some years later went back and discovered he was wrong. I've seen many things in books (and on this forum :-) which don't make sense, and suspect the concept of writing things the authors heard "somewhere" without bothering to go see if they're true is a common thing among violin people--or maybe just people in general.

I've always understood from the context in which I've heard string length mentioned that this was a mania among folk fiddlers as opposed to serious classical players, but perhaps it's an English thing, too, fiddlecollector? All the time I was working retail sales at Bein and Fushi not one single customer asked about string length!

[Mark_W]

The 2:3 ratio of neck length to stop seems to be what makes intonation predictable. If the stop gets too long, the neck length must grow too. This can't be said to conduce much to the average player's comfort.

You can get used to slightly smaller proportions, which work well for many players. I worked on an 1807 violin which had a sort of transitional-length neck. I don't remember the stop, but the S.L. was about 12 5/8", or about 1/4" shorter than a modern setup. I found it a delight to play, and the intonation seemed quite natural.

Mark_W