strings for folk music

[dobro]

Hey all you folk-fiddlers out there(wether irish,bluegrass,old-time or scandinavian)What strings do you prefere,and why?Regards Dobro.

[Hank Taylor]

I've always used Prim Green strings. Besides sounding good for Irish and Old Time, they can be retuned for cross tuning a fiddle without fear of breaking and seem to hold up well in the weather(outside playing). I've just now tried Zyex strings and haven't used them long enough to give advice, but they seem ok for Irish, maybe too bright for the Old Time sound.

[Yankee Fiddler]

Hank, are Prims a bright sounding string? What does "green" mean? They come in colors?

Yankee Fiddler

[Archinto]

I use helicores and so do all my freinds. Although, I wouldn't recommend tuning "up" they tend to break. Other than that, they play great!

-Archinto-

[bob kogut]

I'm with Hank, Prim strings are the best all around strings at any price for different fiddling styles.They are metal, but do not have the harshness of those super sensitive red label strings.They are very easy to play as far as immediate resonse, double stop intonation, staying in tune,etc.They hold their trueness forever( months and months of hard playing). They do not require any break in period;sound and play good as soon as they are installed.

I use them on all my newly built fiddles.Every once in a while, I try the more expensive strings to see if I'm missing something better, but I always go back to the Prims.The Helicore Heavy Gauge come close, as do the Evah Pirazzi's, but the Prim have that attack that responds so easily on the bow.

Up close,there is some mild string noise from the bow when they are new, but it is not discernable a few feet away.

For string snobs, I guess you could paint the color of your favorite more expensive strings on the windings, and call it whatever you want.

[Hank Taylor]

Yankee Fiddler,

I think there are two types of Prims, red and green. The greens were recommended and I used them and have not tried the reds. The greens also come in three flavors, I have always used the mediums.

[fiddlefaddle]

I use Prims too for dance music, and find the descriptions above to be valid. They are workhorse strings with no real objectionable qualities.

I'd like to fool around with other strings, but i have so many other things to fool around with, I don't have the time or money.

Bud

[Yankee Fiddler]

O.K., could someone explain why Prim strings come in Red and Green? Is it like the Blue and Red Infeld strings? Is one supposed to be darker, or brighter?

Thanks again,

Yankee Fiddler

[dobro]

Thanks for interesting replies.I have been using Prim for half a year and I like them.Here in Norway they come in three types,brown(orchestral,strong sound),green(medium tone) and blue(soft tone).I have used brown,but a luthier Ive used for resetting up(what an expression,excuse my scandinavian.....)my fiddle,thought it sounded too harsh and shrill,and wanted me to try Corellis for a while,although he knows Im into irish and scandinavian folk music....I havent got my fiddle back yet,so I dont know the result.Guess Ill try the green Prims when the Corellis are worn out.Have any of you heard fiddlers complain about the Prims sounding too hard?

Regards Dobro.

[Ed Wallace]

I play Irish fiddle and I hate all steel strings. Synthetic strings might seem to respond a little more slowly at first but when you get used to them you'll find that you can do so much more with them in terms of different tone colours . Steel strings last a lot longer and they're easier to cross tune but as someoone else said on this forum they seem to have two sounds,on and off, or something to that effect. A lot of people think steel strings are better suited to fiddle music, I disagree. Of course, a lot of people sound great playing them! But I think they'd sound better playing synthetics. Do a search in the archives. There are HUNDREDS of posts on this topic already. It's up to you what you think sounds good on YOUR fiddle. Good luck!

[dobro]

Thanks,Ed.Ill scan the posts...by the way,what syntetic strings do you use for irish fiddling?

Regards Dobro.

[luthier711]

Our shop has all but stopped selling steel strings. Almost all of our fiddling customers are using Helicores.( and we're only fifty miles from winfield) The prims are OK if you just want shrill volume, but the Helicores actually give a quality sound. Our main problem with the steel strings is tension. They put almost twice as much tension on the violin as modern strings.We feel lots of instruments are harmed by long term steel string use.

[Ed Wallace]

I go back and forth between Tonicas and Dominants. Those are actually the only ones I've tried.

[Hank Taylor]

Luthier711,

I have been playing on Prim strings for years and have never gotten shrill volume out of them, although I'm sure an inexperienced player could, especially on a cheaper fiddle. I like to play waltzes and airs and get plenty of warmth out of the strings. I've also used them quite adequately for playing orchestral music, even though they aren't my first choice.

[jbgilm]

Are Helicores high tension strings?

quote:

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Originally posted by luthier711:

Our shop has all but stopped selling steel strings. Almost all of our fiddling customers are using Helicores.( and we're only fifty miles from winfield) The prims are OK if you just want shrill volume, but the Helicores actually give a quality sound. Our main problem with the steel strings is tension. They put almost twice as much tension on the violin as modern strings.We feel lots of instruments are harmed by long term steel string use.

---

[luthier711]

Hank, nothing personal. It's just that in our experience, the Helicores sound better. It's all we use on viola and our first choice for fiddles. When we've convinced someone to switch, they always agree. I don't believe they would be classified as a high tension string. They feel very soft under the fingers compared to Prims.

[Hank Taylor]

Luthier711,

No problem, I hope I didn't come on too strong. I find myself sometimes walking a thin line between what I think I need to say and what really needs to be said to get the point across, especially in this format where people who know much more will be reading what I say. We all have our own opinions on what works, and what suits one person is an ill fit for another. With strings and violins the taste is very personal, and there are usually divergent thoughts somewhere. I think what's important is to respect other opinions.

[Lane]

My first post on this board was a string related question. Bob Kogut turned me on to Helicores. I have been using medium tension and I really love the way they sound. They took alittle getting used to but the proof is in the pudd'n!

[glmfiddler]

I have been using Prim strings (green) for at least 20 years. Never had a problem with them. I only play Texas style fiddle, not violin stuff. They always sound good, any position,and are no problem when I get in different climates,ie. Wa., Tx. La. Id. Mt.I like them alot.I tried Helicores, didn't like the baggines of them, and the aluminum wrapped A string sounded too thin for me. glm.

[This message has been edited by glmfiddler (edited 10-14-2001).]

[bob kogut]

quote:

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Originally posted by luthier711:

Our shop has all but stopped selling steel strings. Almost all of our fiddling customers are using Helicores.

---

Aren't Helicores steel strings?

[This message has been edited by bob kogut (edited 10-15-2001).]

[crystal]

I can't say enough about John Pearse Artiste strings. THey are a synthetic and are the closest to steels you can come. One web site describes their tone as "majestic".

I will tell you an experience that I had just yesterday morning. I had been playing with J.P's. for the last couple of weeks and loving it, but my strings are very old, because they were a used set that someone gave me to try quite a long time ago.

So, I thought I'd change my strings yesterday before our celtic session. I put on new strings called Flexocor Permanents. I thought these were going to be "it"!!!

When I put them on, my husband came down and said, "What on earth did you do?" He said the strings were squeaky between the strings, and sounded low and muddy.

I put the J.P.'s back on and the difference was absolutely incredible. Majestic is really a good word for them. They ring out a long time after, they feel soft and good under the fingers, they are smooth, and yet my husband said, you can "identify the note", it's clear and bright.

For about $22 a set, I highly recommend you give them a try.

[Neighbor's Bane]

quote:

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Originally posted by luthier711:

Our main problem with the steel strings is tension. They put almost twice as much tension on the violin as modern strings.We feel lots of instruments are harmed by long term steel string use.

---

What do the other luthiers among us feel about the damaging effect of steel strings? Do you think they should be avoided across the board, even on new, presumably sound and robust instruments, or is caution advised mainly with more delicate and rickety instruments?

My first instrument fell into the second category, and I remember a luthier advising me against steel strings for the reason given by luthier711. I've since bought a new violin though, currently strung with Dominants, and based on what's been said here I'm itching to try a set of Prims.

I'd also like to try a set on my new Wiplstix. I've been having trouble getting a decent sound out of it, and I can imagine a new set of strings will help.

[lwl]

Apparently some luthiers say the same about synthetics, strangely enough -- is there really that much of a tension difference?

I've persuaded a friend of mine here in the Bay Area to replace her Eudoxas with Obligatos, as apparently her home is poorly climate-controlled and consequently the Eudoxas have problems holding pitch, plus they break frequently. But her luthier (don't know which of the shops it was) told her that the high tension of synthetics compared to gut would damage her violin. (Turn-of-the-century, probably French, moderate price, i.e., not a student instrument.)

[bob kogut]

quote:

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Originally posted by Neighbor's Bane:

What do the other luthiers among us feel about the damaging effect of steel strings? Do you think they should be avoided across the board, even on new, presumably sound and robust instruments, or is caution advised mainly with more delicate and rickety instruments?

---

My opinion based on personal experience:I've used Prims on various vintage European violins that I owned at the time for over 20 years,some rather delicately built.Sure, I've had a few neck joints drop, but not because of excessive string tension, but because of eventual mechanical failure in the joint.Each time, it would have needed a neck reset anyway. If a fiddle is kept up to date with regular maintenance,ie, resetting/regluing when needed; and if it was originally made using established methods of securing the various parts, graduations, arching, etc, then there is absolutely nonothing to worry about using prim medium tension strings, or any other medium tension string.If a fiddle is considered that delicate to avoid certain strings on it,then it needs reinforcement procedures before using any kind of string.

As far as new violins: I've strung up my newly made violins with Prims from the onset with no adverse events happening.Prims can withstand a lot of 'abuse'without breaking; as far as with a new fiddle, constantly taking the tension off and back on to perform the sequence of adjustments a new fiddle needs in the first several weeks of completion.Reports from owners of my fiddles show no problems with Prims over the past 6 years I've been buiding them.

[deb]

After reading here, I decided to purchase a set of Prims -- and just installed them today. My teacher was here and changed a couple strings to show me how, and I finished it.

There's a lot of difference between these and the previous ones set up on the violin, I'm glad I changed!

I wondered for two days whether I should get the Helicores or the Prims, and finally decided that my budget had to be the limiting factor -- umemployed web site folks don't get the more expensive strings!

I enjoyed this discussion and the honest and terrific advice here from other players.

Maybe the next time I want/need to change strings I'll be employed again and will try the Helicores.

Thanks,

deb