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hk1997

New Concertos

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I would like to invert it: why all the recent violin concerts sound so "neoromantic" or "neoclassic"? I think there`s still a false notion especially in the american audience, that we should avoid dissonance and atonalism because "people don`t like it". No one should be forced to like it, but that`s not so simple, I believe.

Well, 1: "people don`t like" because they don`t know how to listen to it, they are not used to it;

2: great composers usually don`t care so much about people "expect to listen to", they transcend that;

3: there are some GREAT violin concerts from the XX century that doesn`t sound like Hollywood movies( I`m not criticizing the movies here, maybe I should also, but nevermind) : Schoenberg, Berg, Penderecki, Shostakovich, Bartók, and others (by the way, recently I listened to Christopher Rouse`s concert, an american composition from the 90`s, very interesting).

I`m not saying that "atonal" is better than "romantic"; the thing is: I like well-composed pieces( of course), and a well composed piece must offer something new, as I feel. And, honestly, I can`t see so much novelty about all those neoromantic concerts, from Sibelius, Elgar, Glazunov, etc., to now. That`s not the only way of making good music, I`m sure.

About John Williams: Richard Strauss is MUCH better at the same style, I`m sorry. And good for movies also... check Stanley Kubrick.

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quote:

Originally posted by your_piano_stud:

To HK, I used to have problem with anything that comes after Debussy, but I've learned to appreciate some 20th century compositions.

And of course, the appreciation for a certian kind of music can come from direct experience. Back in High School, I wouldn't have touched Debussy. But we had to play a piece in orchestra (can't remember...had harp solo). Lo and behold, we won the state championship with it. Aside from the major themes in the first movement, I really didn't like the Tchaikovsky Violin Concerto at the first sitting. But it grew on me. I can say the same about the Brahms. But it's taking longer for atonal stuff. Wasn't it Milstein who found the Sibelius hideous? So I'm sure there are some pros who share my viewpoint.

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Dutilleux's concerto entitled "L'arbre des songes", which was recorded by Isaac Stern for Sony, is a masterpiece. (The coupling on this CD, the concerto by Peter Maxwell Davies, is worth a listen but isn't quite a success to my ears.) I am also fond of the concerti by Elliott Carter (a work in his "late" style, more lyrical and less knotty than his middle-period music) and Joan Tower (this one might be classified as "neoromantic" but it's not at all saccharine). The Tower has received a beautiful recording by Elmar Oliveira, who is on my personal list of the most underrated violinists.

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Heh...I kind of liken it to food. I personally love Mexican food. There are many types of foods from Mexico. I particularly like Tex-Mex. When I eat a fajita, I take a tortilla, stuff it with meat, sour cream, guacamole, tomatoes, etc. Everything goes into my mouth like a symphony and it brings me great enjoyment.

If I include jalapeno or habanero peppers in my fajita, my eyes water, my face turns red, I might have to spit it out. It's downright painful! Paco, who is sitting right next to me, eats the darn things raw like they were candy. Is there something wrong with me? Maybe there's something wrong with him! Probably missing a few tastebuds or something. But it would be wrong for me to go to the cook and say, "Hey! Your food is muy sucky!".

And so, I've tried to slowly assimilate my tongue to the spicyness. Today, I could have a some mild picante sauce with my food and it'll be a little spicy, but I can live with it. I may not like it as much with it than without it. But I just can't handle really spicy food. Heh...sorry...dinner time. laugh.gif

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quote:

Originally posted by MrWoof:

Here is a link to a midi experiment I threw down the other day for some incidental music between scenes of the opera I am beginning.

Let me know if you love it or loathe it. Do one or the other please don't tell me it's nice!

smile.gif

Don Crandall

don, i like listening to your works. this segment sounds like an idea puzzling a character? crazy.gif did he encounter something which has him developing a plot or mixing a solution? is he up to something? am i perceiving right, wrong? i think he's hatching a plan which might not be on the up and up. cool.gif

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WTG hk! Keep working with those chilis. Before long you'll be enjoying a "salsa muy caliente" one day, and still savor a cool salade Nicoise the next smile.gif

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quote:

Originally posted by shiftsuper175607:

Friends,

Can anyone tell me where I can listen to some of the concerti mentioned here?

Meyer, Veale, Williams, Berg, Walker, Bailey ?

Thanks Neil <//>x

Check out Amazon.com- chances are that excerpts from some or most of those are available online there, and if you like what you hear Amazon is a good place to buy the CDs. Just search by composer- their search engine works well.

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This is my favorite way to find recordings. Look it up on All Classical ( http://allclassical.com/ ), and then use the "Buy" links to open CDNow. Listen to the samples when available and order if you want it.

All Classical is really extensive, gives lots of info on each composer, and even lists "out of print" recordings in case you want to track them down.

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mmm... this is turning really a tasty discussion...

No music has to be neoromantic, neoclassica, romantic, or classical, to be successful. Look at John Adam's concerto, not many people in this post really "indulge" into that piece of music, but within the past few years, two main stream players recorded it (Shaham in 01 and Kremer in 94). And I think these two CD's ain't too bad. So i guess what constitute a great composer, or a great piece of music doesn't depend on the style.

It's always nice to have new ideas in a piece of music. What makes a composer great is his/her ability to convey his/her idea, despite they are old or new. I, personally, find dissonance/atonality hinders the idea expression process. To me, personally, I get distracted and sometimes annoyed by atonal music such as Stern's recording of Peter Maxwell Davies and Dutilleux's concerto. It was nicely played, but due to my ignorance, uneducated ear, and/or my old mind, I just can handle it.

HK use a good analogy. I love spicy good. But when a something is too spicy, your sense of taste is busying feeling spicy, you can't taste other ingredients. A dish may have used some very fresh delicious sea food, but when it's too spicy, you can't taste the sea food anymore. In paralle, a piece of music can be nice, but the dissonance can overwhelm some people's sense of hearing.

That's why I admire Shostakovitch and Prokofiev. They've made their musical dish better with dissonance rather than making it worse.

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It's not a concerto, and it's not on the level of the top 10, but Richard Nanes' Rhapsodie Pathetique for Violin and Orchestra is not too old (1985), and very easy to listen to.

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MrWoof

How did you create that MIDI file??

wow!! your piece is certainly reminding me of something, but I will not tell it to you. Where did you get your inspiration from?

jeffie

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quote:

Originally posted by Jeffie:

MrWoof

How did you create that MIDI file??

wow!! your piece is certainly reminding me of something, but I will not tell it to you. Where did you get your inspiration from?

jeffie

Thank you, I am glad you appreciate it. It is simple to save as a midi just one of the options available with Finale.

As for inspiration that comes from burying both parents, a brother, and an infant niece and coming to the realization that life is a bonified miracle and that there is love, beauty, wonder, and music all around.

As for creating a composition you first have to understand what it is you are trying to say then the rest is mechanically manipulating voices, instruments, and ideas to express that. The what to say part is much more difficult though in my opinion.

In a nutshell there it is.

I am glad that the music spoke to you. Thank you for your kind comment.

Regards,

Don Crandall

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quote:

Originally posted by Jeffie:

Mr Woof

May I share some MIDI files that I have that is similar to yours?

Can I send them to you through email?

Sure send them to Don@tropicstar.com

at my work email.

Don

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HK1997, I don't know if you were referring to the Nanes, nor do I know if there's a sample on the net. I listened to it on a tape from the library.

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