Guido

Wait till you see the matching 4s! The seemingly original spruce core fingerboard doesn't have much wear, which should answer some of the questions about condition and the violin having been played much or not. As for the missing bass bar, yes, the plate is just thick instead! Arguably, there is an integrated bass bar without the wood around it being removed. It's a fairly even 45-55mm thick and weighs 101g (yeah, the top).

I can't see the violin resembling any of the common models. Looks more like a competent amateur doing his own thing. Even though you say there are glue marks from a previous label underneath the current one, I wouldn't dismiss it just yet. The little I see in one of the pictures, it may have been the same label, now just re-glued in a different spot. P.S.: And yes there is a common trap to view uncommon/ crude/ clumsy work as archaic leading to an overestimation of age.

They may well be better quality than your current bow, but you are looking at $200+ (each) to get them playing. That money should buy you a reasonable (new) bow and you'd probably be better off. Having said that, the light coloured one looks better, albeit you only show it from a distance so it's hard to tell.

I'm aware... most Cremonese instruments are very thin though, mostly between 2mm and 2.5mm throughout, including under the bridge. Stad in particular can go as low as 2mm under the bridge and well under 2mm in the lungs. I would doubt many modern makers dare to go there. (Of course we don't quite know how many Cemonese instruments have been thinned) That's interesting as Stainer graduations are usually thicker in the centre (think 3.5mm) with the top being similar to the back (proportionally). But I pragmatically view "baroque" as a modern concept, not necessarily wanting to meet the taste and requirements of earlier centuries. Not sure a violin with Stainer graduations would be a highlight in the local baroque ensemble :-)

I know you could just look at, and gather data from, historic examples as far as possible, but: Just curious what people do regarding weight and graduations to meet player expectations for "baroque" as much as possible. Given the lower string tension I assume one can/should go lighter in the plates than for a modern violin? And maybe favour easy response over volume? Thinner back in particular? Any experience/ recommendation, especially if expressed in grams, much appreciated.

In addition to everything else: For cello: check the locknut on the spike. And: it can be a different string that’s broken, but vibrates/buzzes when you play on the d-String.

The outline looks to be Hopf/ Klingenthal school. Can you confirm the neck attachment? Looks like it might be a through neck.

They go as far as putting fake strings on, too. These are fake Obligatos.

Yes it it. But with an original through neck construction that’s quite common even with these relatively young fiddles second half 19th century.

Yeah, cos it was originally a one-piece back. Muah-ha. I could also imagine the darker overcoat might be later addition and the light honey colour underneath was the original appearance which would be quite typical for the times before the end of the 19th century. In this light I might give it a couple more decades of age and would say second half of 19th century.

Interesting what people pick on while not mentioning the sound post crack, the bass bar crack or the crack running the length of the back.

That explains the gloss. It has been moenninged.

Buying this at a dealer you should assume the a-peg crack to be repaired (probably an inlaid ring on the inside). You may want to clarify, but its a minor thing in any case. The violin looks like it could be; but these are notoriously difficult to be sure about.

Final piece of info on the OP bow. It comes in at 59.7g (with 3.40g of silver wire instead of 1.0-1.5g of tinsel).

BTW, if you don't like mis-matched metals between mounts and grip, fake gold goes well with fake whale bone :-)

49mm at the bottom, 46.5mm at the stick, with the heel rising 19mm from the stick. I guess if it doesn't pass muster as a violin bow it will be a viola bow.

There are various variations of brass alloys, with more or less copper, zinc and maybe something else. “Tombak“ is another name to google. Not sure if it’s the same as pinchbeck or slightly different.

The solder is still fine, just one winding came off. Takes about a millisecond to trim off and move on.

Yes, but it was designed with tinsel in mind and never intended to have a wire. Also, even if it's not really relevant, I measure the difference between tinsel and wire as 2.0g-3.0g depending on the diameter of the wire and the diameter of the stick for a 7cm winding. That would be 64/65g for the bow. Granted, it may still be a viola bow for a small viola. As I said I can't quite shake the thought.

For scale, here is a comparison with my trusted Pfretzschner.

Wow! I thought I had seen a few bows, but never saw anything like that! Maybe some of these are viola bows? That's actually a thought I had and still can't quite shake with the OP. It would weigh 62g with hair, so I sort of dismissed the idea.

Thanks, understood, that's good to know. On this occasion I was also quite limited in my selection of pearl, as most of my blanks were too narrow. I had to make do with one of these (some are more plain on the flip side).

Yes, sorry, wasn't clear on this. I just fitted that as the bow came to me w/o peal slide. I made it with a 1.7mm ebony backing and a 0.5mm pearl. Overall 2.2mm thick - but I had to fit the space/ channel. Never seen a slide of this heft.

Pulled another one from the stash that looks somewhat different/ interesting. Most notable is the wide ferrule (14mm) with the visual impression even further augmented by the shape of the frog, getting super narrow a little down from the stick. Overall the bow feels very precise, but that might just be because the frog moves smoothly on the stick like some precision engineering without any free play. I also noticed a flat section on the stick behind the head. And a rather brave mortice.