bean_fidhleir

I would feel fine paying $45 for a well-done closure of an open back seam. I probably wouldn't feel as good about paying that much for closing a small open edge seam (e.g., between the table and the ribs), but that's a simpler repair than rejoining a back seam or invisibly repairing a crack.

I just looked at the listing for the first time. This guy had a buyer back out at $800 and he wants you to pay 100 MORE than that?!? I would definitely run away from anyone who behaved like that! He evidently thinks you're a fish who can't let go of the bait.

I agree with Miles--unless you really reeeaally want that fiddle, run away.

The more you find out, the shadier he sounds, doesn't he?

Did you save a copy of the screen that advertised the cello you bought? That would be best, but even having a record of his changing the terms from one instrument to the next would be a help. In your place, I might indeed talk to a lawyer, because this man's disclaimer is mostly a bluff. That's what the FTC is all about: setting minimum standards that cannot be disclaimed. This man is in business and is making money by selling things that he can inspect carefully but you can't. And I would bet he is mostly selling on his own account, too, rather than on consignment as he cliams. Since he is in business and not a one-time seller, the FTC says he has a duty to describe his goods fairly and accurately, not omitting any factor that would have an effect on the price or on your willingness to buy. (Do you remember the case some years back about how GM was found to be putting Chevy engines, I think it was, into Cadillacs? There was an enormous stink over it because to justify the price difference GM advertised Cadillacs as being much better cars than a Chev. They tried to disclaim and duck out, but it went to court and they lost. I don't remember exactly what happened to them, but I seem to remember that since they're such a big company it wasn't much (the American way!). But they did lose in court, because of having breached their duty to deliver the product they advertised.)

quote: Originally posted by: escargofast What is the Uniform Commercial Code? I would like to pursue to get my money back, the cello is nice, but if I had the choice on cello's I would not have bought it. Now that I bought this cello, I am a little more savvy on fake labels. Plus with his photos, I have asked him(under my daughters ebay id), that he send me a regular digital photo of his instruments and he said he would and never did. The only one he did send out was on the Ficker cello that he wanted me to trade, but not all the sides that I requested. When he sold the Ficker there was a crack in the rib. I might have been wrong about it being the UCC...it could be the FTC Act instead: quote: What truth-in-advertising rules apply to advertisers? Under the Federal Trade Commission Act: advertising must be truthful and non-deceptive; advertisers must have evidence to back up their claims; and advertisements cannot be unfair. Additional laws apply to ads for specialized products like consumer leases, credit, 900 telephone numbers, and products sold through mail order or telephone sales. And every state has consumer protection laws that govern ads running in that state. What makes an advertisement deceptive? According to the FTC's Deception Policy Statement, an ad is deceptive if it contains a statement - or omits information - that: is likely to mislead consumers acting reasonably under the circumstances; and is "material" - that is, important to a consumer's decision to buy or use the product. What makes an advertisement unfair? According to the Federal Trade Commission Act and the FTC's Unfairness Policy Statement, an ad or business practice is unfair if: it causes or is likely to cause substantial consumer injury which a consumer could not reasonably avoid; and it is not outweighed by the benefit to consumers. How does the FTC determine if an ad is deceptive? A typical inquiry follows these steps: The FTC looks at the ad from the point of view of the "reasonable consumer" - the typical person looking at the ad. Rather than focusing on certain words, the FTC looks at the ad in context - words, phrases, and pictures -ÿto determine what it conveys to consumers. The FTC looks at both "express" and "implied" claims. An express claim is literally made in the ad. For example, "ABC Mouthwash prevents colds" is an express claim that the product will prevent colds. An implied claim is one made indirectly or by inference. "ABC Mouthwash kills the germs that cause colds" contains an implied claim that the product will prevent colds. Although the ad doesn't literally say that the product prevents colds, it would be reasonable for a consumer to conclude from the statement "kills the germs that cause colds" that the product will prevent colds. Under the law, advertisers must have proof to back up express and implied claims that consumers take from an ad. The FTC looks at what the ad does not say - that is, if the failure to include information leaves consumers with a misimpression about the product. For example, if a company advertised a collection of books, the ad would be deceptive if it did not disclose that consumers actually would receive abridged versions of the books. The FTC looks at whether the claim would be "material" - that is, important to a consumer's decision to buy or use the product. Examples of material claims are representations about a product's performance, features, safety, price, or effectiveness. The FTC looks at whether the advertiser has sufficient evidence to support the claims in the ad. The law requires that advertisers have proof before the ad runs. What kind of evidence must a company have to support the claims in its ads? Before a company runs an ad, it has to have a "reasonable basis" for the claims. A "reasonable basis" means objective evidence that supports the claim. The kind of evidence depends on the claim. At a minimum, an advertiser must have the level of evidence that it says it has. For example, the statement "Two out of three doctors recommend ABC Pain Reliever" must be supported by a reliable survey to that effect. If the ad isn't specific, the FTC looks at several factors to determine what level of proof is necessary, including what experts in the field think is needed to support the claim. In most cases, ads that make health or safety claims must be supported by "competent and reliable scientific evidence" - tests, studies, or other scientific evidence that has been evaluated by people qualified to review it. In addition, any tests or studies must be conducted using methods that experts in the field accept as accurate. http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/ad-faqs.htm

quote: Originally posted by: falstaff Check out the wood on the back of this Guadagnini.... I've never seen an example where the direction of the grain reversed.... That grain reversal is rather neat-looking! I wonder whether it has an effect on the sound. Michael? Jeffrey?

Perhaps he's mafiya. He's almost certainly a Russian-speaker, since his account name means 'owner' in Russian. Definitely not a calligrapher though. He seems to have picked up a few old German trade fiddles and apparently is trying to pass them off as whatever he can invent. The back arching on the 'Louis Otto' one looks really scary.

It sounds as though you did indeed get taken, but in a very subtle way. You might still be able to get him, though, if you wanted to work at it. If his ebay record says he mostly sells stringed instruments, then his 'poor ignorant consignment shop' excuse might not hold up so well if you challenge it. I know that people in the USA who sell refrigerators or whatever have a responsibility to advertise their goods correctly and not mislead people. So if someone who has a regular business tricks you, you can almost automatically get your money back by waving the Uniform Commercial Code at them. It's something to think about, anyway.

quote: Originally posted by: escargofast But I got suckered into a very expensive mistake with fineconsignments on ebay. I bought a cello from them and boy did I get ripped off. ... Well I now I own this cello...like I said it is worth what I paid for it and it sounds very nice and sweet. I have been shamed by many people so please don't rub my nose in it! I'm not completely clear about what your position is. You start out saying you got ripped off, and end by saying you got what you paid for. Which was it? Enquiring minds want to know.

My (limited) experience has been that they'll knock off 10%, if asked, but not more.

My only association for that near-colorless varnish is Germany in the '20s and '30s. And the varnish itself looks modern to me--very evenly laid down. The scroll looks very neatly done, but I would guess in my ignorance that it probably did not require anywhere near the work of a more deeply carved one. If that purfling is merely inked (I certainly can't tell by looking!), then I'd also call 'modern' on it because of how regular it is. The rebushed pegs and the graft seem anomalous in light of everything else, and the whole instrument looks more battered than it does worn. So overall I wonder whether it's not a 'fake old' instrument from 1930s Germany, or possibly a composite with the table being older.

Looks like someone got wise--it was pulled

quote: Originally posted by: Jeffrey Holmes It's partially due to these individuals lack of, or tolerance of, the fear of falure that allow them to succeed, isn't it? A thoroughly under-appreciated point for sure, Jeffrey. Thanks!

The first one looks like a "Maggini"-style German trade fiddle made ca. 100 years ago. How well do you like the sound? Because $1300 sounds like the retail price you'd pay in a shop (i.e., it would be a better deal for the seller than for you). The photos of the second one aren't appearing.

What sort of thoughts/ideas are you looking for?

And not an especially high-quality one, either, going by looks

quote: Originally posted by: violinbeginner I'm not buying a violin yet, but probably in the near future. So right now I'm just looking for possible stores, etc. Unfortunately, there are no violin shops where I live, and I'd have to go out of state. OF course, I'm still in High School so I haven't had the chance to check out stores yet. If you're just starting, you might be happier with an older instrument that you buy from someone reputable, like Jesse who writes here (and sells on ebay) as padah_hound. With new instruments from a factory, it's very hard to tell whether they'll be any good. But if you buy an older one that's been played a lot, you have some evidence for it being good. And the price will usually not be any worse.

(This is from a local Russian-language newspaper. I finally decided to put it here since the context is someone buying a fiddle) A nouveau riche Russian goes into the most posh strings shop in Moscow and says 'I want to buy something to impress my friends. Show me the most expensive instrument you have. The proprietor, thinking to put him in his place, brings out a $2M Strad. The arriviste doesn't even blink. 'Price is no object, but the company that made this, it's still in business?' 'No, naturally not--this masterpiece was created in the early 18th century.' 'Well then show me something else because this won't do. How would I ever get replacement parts when it breaks?'

I find it interesting how badly retouched those photos look. Is he getting more hubristic?

quote: Originally posted by: Singingmaple The label in the picture I showed is said to be authentic and the Instrument has been age dated to be accurate. I can't say it was written by Stainer as I wasn't there when it was written. The one pictured on ebay looks to be a copy, as does the violin. The only reason I say "if" is that the hand shown wasn't the norm in German-speaking areas. That's a classical-Italian hand. It found a home in England ( ), but in German-speaking countries they used very different letterforms ( http://www.genealogia.fi/faq/tyyli7.gif ). Note that the German letterforms remained basically unchanged across Stainer's whole life and beyond, and that even the careful English writing has many "funny-looking" non-classical forms where the writer slipped and used the more common letterforms of the time. I find it fascinating. If that label was really written by Stainer, it suggests that he did indeed learn his craft in Italy, and learned the classical handwriting at the same time, whether because that's where he learned to read and write in the first place, or because he needed a legible hand for business.

quote: Originally posted by: Ron1 Looks like it was written through the f-hole. I would think someone of Stainer's caliber; a perfectionist/artist, would be more exacting too, in labeling their instruments. Well, if the viola da gamba label in singingmaple's post is real, then Stainer had got classical penmanship training somewhere. And anybody who'd spend that much time practicing would have taken the top back off rather than do something so sloppy as that scribble in Lundberg's post.

quote: Originally posted by: Singingmaple I am getting worried that it will got to cheap. I listed it low hoping to get more interested buyers but only have 1 bid this far. Can you not cancel the listing? Many people do that. It would be better, wouldn't it, to cancel now rather than have to sell for a fraction of what the fiddle is worth?

I know what you mean and don't blame you a bit. I bought a fiddle through a well-known auction house some time ago and am fairly sure I paid about $300-500 more than I should have. The final price was raised because of a last-minute bidder who seemed to go around making a single bid on many different instruments near the close of bidding for each one. His bids were never 'last-minute' bids and he never actually had the winning bid. Very annoying to think about.

Quote: No, i cant see one, its very well hidden if there is. The graft looks a bit odd because often when you do them and the top of the peg box is wider than the normal nut width,you get the graft line going backwards at the top as opposed to curling forward as is more usual.I think its a real graft. I have to agree on the crack--I was going to point out what I thought I saw, but now can't find it again. Annoying. The reason the graft seems more like a scratch to me is that the wood on both sides appears to agree awfully well, and the line wobbles to a degree that seems more consistent with someone dragging a spike bumpitty-bump across hard and soft grain changes than with someone cutting through them with a razor saw. It's a pity that we don't know who bought it--it would be nice to be able to ask them for details.