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Blank face

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Posts posted by Blank face

  1. Agree that the violin doesn’t look like anything very special, but do we know how good a violin made by EH Roth in person should look like? The question is how this could be factually proven, if not by hearsay and business advertising.

    There’s probably too much of the latter being brought up by the firm to create a sort of myth. That’s quite an invitation for all kind of puffery around it.:)

  2. 2 hours ago, schuy said:

    I’m still trying to learn how to better identify bows. I’m wondering what you folks think of this one. To me the frog looks right, but the button and the stick are less clear. I don’t see any pins on the button, for instance.

    Do you guys think this is all original? And does it look like pernambuco, or something else? 


    thank you!

    This looks to me like a Mirecourt workshop/factory bow, Abeille/nickel half mounted, probably made in the early 20th century. I would not dare to ascribe it to any particular shop with certainty.

     Photo 10 shows in my eyes a small pin at the inner adjuster ring, if that was confusing you. 

  3. One would need to know if they asked the Roth shop for confirmation. As I said, it could be from any better Markneukirchen workshop. OTOH, the early Roths from Cozio are so very different in themselves that the OP would fit easily in this row.

    And BTW it isn't a build on the back construction, but shows mitred rib joints. Another point for Roth shop.

    I guess that the general idea about EHR violins is mostly influenced by the 1920/30s high end models meant for the American market. What they made before that period is more common Markneukirchen style.

  4. 1 hour ago, FiddleMkr said:

    Thank you.

    what is the dark brown residue (do you think) that is adhered to the sides of the pegbox and scroll? 

    Probably a mixture of dirt and the thick crackling/darkening redbrown Mittenwald varnish, which is often misunderstood as burned/heated. At the body it seems to be worn off to the biggest part, only visible at some points of the ribs and the edge flutings, and at the tailpiece region.

  5. Though Hinterkopf translates to the back, in regards of a scroll it means also the height of the upper winding and the upper front/forehead. That's what we are seeing here very pronounced.

    I wouldn't say that it is exclusively to South Germany/Füssen, it can be found also at a lot of Saxon, Bohemian and even Neapolitan scrolls.

  6. Gragnani from Livorno used whalebone, too. Hamma mentons it, and the Berlin Musikinstrumentenmuseum had one in it's exhibition. It was very obvious, because in the next glass case were a Rombouts and a Jacobs featuring the same kind of purfling.

  7. 8 hours ago, GeorgeH said:

    Not only the chippy varnish, but the poorly-executed scroll with the small volute and plain wood is nothing like I have ever seen in a genuine Roth violin. It also lacks the crisp workmanship of EHR himself and even of the entry-level EHR workshop violins. 

    With the prices of Roth violins getting higher and higher, it shouldn't be surprising that fake Roth labels are showing up in run-of-the-mill Markneukichen cottage-industry fiddles, which is what this looks like to me. If it is described as "1902 - 1919" then the seller doesn't have to have explain why it does not have a brand stamp and serial number.

    I can see all of your points, but the crispyness might be worn down (as it looks like) and the whole instrument not be kept very well. EHR himself might have had enough occupation in his office to let the work on top of the line violins to those of his workers with more experience and skills.:rolleyes:

  8. 16 hours ago, Altgeiger said:

    Does this violin happen to be located in Indiana? It looks very familiar.

    The photos are looking like taken from a professionel website. So it might be not much difficult to find out the original source, and probably there are more informations to find. I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be legit (though surely not made by Henry).^_^

  9. A lot of the otherwise good workmanship here is in my eyes blurred by the brittle and chippy varnish. I can’t tell if it is that bad from the beginning or was stored wrong, too hot, too humid or something else. I would like to know if the ff are fluted.

    At least I have seen at auctions some of the lesser Roths from the period, all branded and genuine labelled, looking not much different. They also didn’t use the same varnish for all grades.

    Having said this, I’m not much experienced in Roths, but they seem often a bit overrated to me. It depends much if the OP had a real brand and labeling. Otherwise it looks „in the white“ like a not that bad Markneukirchen to me, as I wrote before, which could be from any shop.

  10. 5 hours ago, Aston4 said:

    It seems obvious to me that the point of teaching children in schools to take care of school provided instruments is because I paid for the damn things with my taxes and they better damned well not steal more of my money to give the sniveling little brats another one should they break it.  

    In fact there's a lot of truth in this. We can't afford to buy permanently all this jingles, frame drums, flutes, Glockenspiels and all the ridiculous but expensive stuff. Stringed instruments are always well insured, so I should teach the kids better to break these and let the rest alone, instead of all the hypocrisis.

    In the long run this would also boost the actually starving violin and bowmakers, when all the worn-out used garbage is put to waste finally, and it will also put an end to the redundant strives about what's better, old or new.

    So far this was probably what the thread was meant about, I'm hoping I'm straight on topic.:)

  11. 4 hours ago, wooden said:

    Both Blank face and Jacob agree in Fussen origin. I am not an expert at all so I began to search in books and could see some similarity with Fichtl. I think he came from Fussen and his work is inspired by Stainer. But this is just my opinion and surely it will be wrong...

    Lüttgendorff is listing more than 20 Fichtl (Fichtel, Fichtold etc.) named makers, working also in other places like Vienna.

    Nearly the same number of Stoss, then several Nigg/Niggels, Petz and so on. So one would need to check through all this. In the other tread going on at the moment it was pointed out that it's usually not "straight forward", but a lot of instruments are workshop cooperations (parents/children, master/apprentice, employee A/employee B and the like). But if you're lucky, you can find sometimes hidden pencil signatures, telling who might have made the box. As the violin was a feast for the worms :( but looks otherwise relatively untouched there might be a chance.

  12. Doesn't look like the typical Mittenwald, but could be from this region - or Füssen and it's "outsourcings". One would need to search for a bona fide signed reference, what can be difficult.

    At the scroll it can be studied what's the meaning of "Hinterkopf".;)

  13. 16 hours ago, LCF said:

    Per the photos at least there seems to be discontinuity in the style of the top purfling near all corners. Perhaps those areas have also been rebuilt - repaired? 

    One would need to see more closely if there is some half-edging or other indications in that regions. All the irregularities in purfling joints, edgework etc. are described in the essay by J.Hersch. To me the belly purfling looks a bit thinner, the joints shorter than at the bottom, but this could be also caused by the working method. At least there are limitations looking at photos only.

  14. On balance I would think that it is from Mirecourt/French, too. Some of the antiquing/wood staining looks similar to what they did in Markneukirchen, but construction, scroll, edges and so on look more French. Maybe some heavily antiqued JTL from the early 1900s.

    There's a dark stripe of mineral deposits in the middle of the back, but also a short crack down right. Not nice, but far away from the soundpost region.

  15. 38 minutes ago, Aston4 said:

    The forum folks below would be appalled at the things my dad did with his chainsaw.  When my dad bought it used, it was already "antique."  It was a good price (at the time) and he needed to cut trees, horrible weeds they are. Many would consider it sacrilege what he did with that expertly crafted, HEAVY, solid aluminum and steel, 1940s Homelite.  Cheapest oil, cheapest gas, scratched at nearly every outing, without care or concern.  Sharpened with a cheap Sears file, and poorly sharpened at that.  That era of chainsaws was arguably the "golden age." The skilled machinests with the ability to craft such remarkable, beautiful, yet functional chainsaws, have long passed, and their skilset with them. Then, get this: when it was worn out, instead of having an expert restoration lovingly done, HE THREW IT IN THE TRASH and bought a cheap plastic chainsaw to replace it!



    At least I’ve got now the reason for the obsession with Dremels.:)

  16. 1 hour ago, Victor Roman said:

    Myself, I suppose due to education and circumstances have less of a tendency to develop an attachment towards objects, utilitarian ones in particular. I think it is wonderful that musicians such as yourself are concerned with the proper preservation of instruments and bows.. Same time, for myself, a bow is a tool akin to a screwdriver. If it keeps rolling on the table, I'll put some flats on the handle with a file. A tool collector might cringe at this but given that I own the screwdriver, it is plain not his business. If I own a bow who plays well save for some discomfort easily alleviated through a bit of filing of the frog, then so be it.

    Part of my day job teaching pre-school and primary school kids is to get them used to handle musical instruments with respect. I'm saying, for instance "It's different from your toy car: Listen, how nice it sounds, because someone made it this way. See, how nicely it's made, feel, how neatly it is carved. Treat it with respect. Don't drop it. Don't scratch your name in it. Consider that many other kids might use it after you and also have used it before, being so careful that you can play it now." etc. etc.

    I'm very patient knowing that it will take a long time till they will learn, and some might learn never.

    But here I'm completely lost.

  17. 26 minutes ago, jacobsaunders said:

    In German one could say ausgetauscht (exchanged) and translating prepositions generally leads to grief

    In German one says "überschwappen", what is more related to water (from a bathtube for example), or beer out of a glass. With a bit of creativity it's understandable to say "ausschwappen". So in English it might be like "the frog was spilled over"?:)

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