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Anders Buen

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About Anders Buen

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    Oslo, Norway
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    Violin-, Hardanger- fiddle-, room- and architectural acoustics.

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  1. If the instrument is stolen, and the player knows, it may sound harsh.. :-)
  2. Lets say there is a twisting mode or so in a fingerboard neck lying close to a body mode. Slight chnges of fingerboard length or thickness may give an effect on that particular mode. I think there are examples shown in my article. Or at least shared here on MN while I conducted the change from violin to Hardangerfiddle in steps. Inlcuding steps of cutting the fingerboard. I have bought e few custom made dragon hardanger fiddles from China. There is a dip in the B1+ mode and I tried to hollow out the somewhat large heads, and the dip was still there. I know the dip is related to the neck-fingerboard system in some form (also shared here on MN), but that operation did not make much change to the dip nor playability. It was some time between the before and after test, though. In general I think the longer and heavier HF nack gives a lower B1+ mode frequency, although HF in general have thinner backs. Also a possible reason. It is hard, I think, to generalize on this matter. As it is with chinrests as well, I think. It is even harder to percept the changes by playing than to measure a change using high resolution instrumentation. However, I do believe violinists can spot these changes better than a fiddler as they can and my stay longer on each note at a given frequency.
  3. Thanks for being interested! It is a while ago I did these experiments. I do have the strings lying somewhere. I think they are sort of synthetic core strings, not much different from Dominants. They are not of the steel core ones. They are less easy to play, but probably louder. The test instrument is of "high grade", thickish as del Gesu but the wood is likely to be stronger. A rather stiff fiddle. I have not tested the different Chinese strings in detail. Maybe a thing to look into. The larger number of violins tested against hardanger fiddles are mainly with mittel Domintants.
  4. The most compressed version on this is a poster from the 2013 Stockhom Musical Acoustics Conference: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/339587232_Buen_SMAC-242_Poster_A3 The article governing it: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/325392479_THE_ACOUSTICS_OF_THE_HARDANGER_FIDDLE A more recent presentation, also including some speculations on the string effect, theoretically: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/351283853_Some_aspects_of_the_acoustics_of_the_Hardangerfiddle There is a later article as well governing this presentation. However, it is very similar to the one from 2013. If you prefer to hear me talk on a slightly shorter version of the above slides (nothing on the string theory, due to time constraints) i have the presentation from the Baltic Nordic Acoustical Meeting 2021, which was a video conference due to te pandemic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVY7MsN3lZ8&ab_channel=AndersBuen
  5. The Hardangerfiddle is kind of baroque. Gut strings, traditionally, and played at a higher pitch. Shorter and lighter strings makes it sound a little weaker than a violin with Dominants mittel. Still the sound is more intense. The bridge is also different with long legs, chelloish kind of. A baroque bridge would also influence the sound spectrum, and I guess the violins were played at lower pitch. Please correct me if i’m wrong. The pitch varied with the region and instruments there, like flutes, or maybe the church organ. I am sorry that the baroque violin and fiddles are not studied more in the VSA and in general. I think this limits the insights and makes the violin acoustics subject less interesting than it could have been.
  6. Maybe pure sound, and not necessarily loud, may be weak-ish fundamentals on the e-string first position and getting support from the bridge/body hill region instead. Maybe also a sharper dropoff at the very highs. I do not have full control over the bridge body model. But higher damping there can play a role, as well as lower damping of the bridge. In vibration insulation theory, a mass spring system with a dashpot damper (viscous damping) give a stronger filtering above the resonance than does a higher damped system. The response around the resonance will be stronger for the less dqmped system than the more damped one. So a low damped bridge body system may give a clearer bridge/body «formant».
  7. The lowest graph is the interior impedance. What goes out of the instrument in the open end is the part that does not become reflected. The wavefront in a woodwind instrument or a trumpet is a «flutter» going beck and forth in the conical tube, amplified or sustained by the lips or the beating reed. If the impedence is high in the tube, less enters the room behind he tube. With a cone, less becomes reflected and more enters the room. Brass instruments have a high frequency effect you may hear in angry elephants, even sportscars or japanese street racers with long pipes as a «brassy» sound. A trumpet eg, playing loud may sound more brassy, perceived as being louder. The brassiness thing is nonlinear, caused by a sharpeing of the wavefront inside the instrument which leads to higher output of higher frequencies.
  8. I do not like your style either, so we can agree about not liking each others approaches.
  9. You got it! And this is notning to laugh about. It is kind of sad to see, on your behalf.
  10. It is loudness. Why not be happy to get some knowledge on what does infleunce the sound in a hall, Martin?
  11. Not really complex. In room acoustics this is looked upon more in reation to the qualities of the hall rather than the instruments. Most scientiests or consultants do not care about the special traits of given instruments, but may look at them as being characteristic for given gropups of instruments. There is another effect I did not mention in my former post. The air absorption. Air absorbs high frequencies more than the lows. It increases with propagation distance, and dry air absorbs more than humid air. The effects are large enough to be audible if the climate variation is large enough. Days at 15% RH and other summer and autumn climate at 60% would influence the brilliance of a concert hall, and quite possibly the perceived «projection». It will of course also affect the violins, as well. I do not think the violins are all that different in the high frequencies either. Although one may expect the variation to be larger there, in small bands, than for the signature mode range. The ears bandwidth are about as the one third octave bands. At 3,15 kHz the band goes from halfway between 2,5kHz - 3,15 kHz up to halfway between 3,15 kHz - 4 kHz. A little less than 1 kHz bandwidth, for simplicity. Pretty hard averaging and simplificvation goes on there in the highs. I think the playing and listening tests in concert halls and rehearsal rooms are more a learning experience for the participants than real scientific investigations. Listening to violins and evaluate them is different from playing them, although there is some correlation there. Maybe it is a good thing for a player to hear their own instrument being played, as a listener. Part of extending their knowledge of how «they» may sound at distance. Projection over an orchestra is a bit simplified. The music is usually written so the soloist can be heard, although parts may be louder also with soloists playing I guess. In Oslo Concert house the soloist has been gently amplified for ages. I would assume a similar practice for other concert hoses as well. However, they will probaly not tell. I like David Burgess observations, experiences and opinions in this thread.
  12. In room acoustics and sources in it, there are nothing called «projection». There are directivity, room amplification (Strength G) and impulse responses giving the time history and energy drop including reflections arriving at different times. The sound level in a given position form a source can be measured or calculated, although the directivlty of a given violin may differ in the high frequencies, from insturment to instrument. The sound power of a source, like a violin is, the same in a large room and a small one. So tecnically the sound level and «projection» may me assessed in a smaller room. The difference between small and large rooms, like a concert hall, is the time between reflections and maybe the directivy play a larger role in a large room than a small. There is a bit of masking going on for the player, I think. Less so for the right ear. Comparing an instrument to an orchestra is not a reliable reference, as different orchestras do sound different, bacause the insturments, especially the bowed strings, are different, and the muisichians are too. I basically think that a layer can asess the insturment quality and «projection» on his own in a mid to small sized room. Higher «projection» is simply an instrument with stronger output in all ranges, stronger fundamentals and stronger highs around the formants. The violin acoustics researchers knew this already in the 20 ties and more so in the 30ties and 40ties.
  13. I get daily commercials for hand held 3D laser scanners on facebook, typically scanning a person with colors and shape. One of them are $500. Have anyone tried this on violin parts? How precise are they? Does it work for, say, getting useable data on arching?
  14. I think that poisson ratio expression is valid for flat plates with a given dimension so both a ring and Xmode appear. It is almost identical to the expression given in McIntyre and Woodhouses paper on measuring orthotropic plate material properties.
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